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Ukraine - Superthread

KevinB said:

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Romania should be entitled to launch two missile into Russia.
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If NATO doesn't immediately announce and put AD on all borders with Russia and knockout anything that flies over them, then Article 5 will have proven toothless and one of the primary non nuclear deterrents the west has will be rendered impotent and trivial/disregarded.
 
Skysix said:
If NATO doesn't immediately announce and put AD on all borders with Russia and knockout anything that flies over them, then Article 5 will have proven toothless and one of the primary non nuclear deterrents the west has will be rendered impotent and trivial/disregarded.
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Not really... Russia is being dumb, but they haven't launched an attack on a NATO state.
 
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Furniture said:
Not really... Russia is being dumb, but they haven't launched an attack on a NATO state.
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Three missiles into Poland and 2 Drones into Romania, isn’t exactly not an attack either.
While they may not have been planned, at the end of the day landing explosives into a NATO country is an attack.

Moving AA systems to the border areas would be a prudent move, and honestly, I would think that NATO should enforce a 50km no fly zone from their borders.
With the understanding that we will tit for tat any violations by removing a Russia Army HQ from the planet for each of any further violations.
 
KevinB said:
Three missiles into Poland and 2 Drones into Romania, isn’t exactly not an attack either.
While they may not have been planned, at the end of the day landing explosives into a NATO country is an attack.

Moving AA systems to the border areas would be a prudent move, and honestly, I would think that NATO should enforce a 50km no fly zone from their borders.
With the understanding that we will tit for tat any violations by removing a Russia Army HQ from the planet for each of any further violations.
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Anything less is dereliction and cowardice.

Which is the absolute state of the western ruling class.
 
YZT580 said:
the perfect political answer. Which is why we are in this mess in the first place. We always look for an excuse to do nothing
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Or, it's the logical answer based on the reality of the war. The war in Ukraine is unpopular in Russia, doing something that gives the Russians a reason to rally behind the flag is not in Ukraine's best interests.

Russians aren't dumber than we are, they know the difference between NATO forces engaging Russian forces, and NATO equipment being used by Ukraine against Russian forces. The minute Putin and his supporters can show real CNN or BBC reports of NATO forces directly engaging in the fight, it will justify all of their "NATO is coming after us" silliness.

While that's not guaranteed to rally all of Russia behind the war, it's quite likely to reverse a lot of the negative opinion of the war.
 
Colin Parkinson said:
Making stuff like ATGM would seem to be a area that Canada could be very good at if it tried?
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We already have two useful centres to build on

Rockets - Magellan Aerospace

For more than 60 years, Magellan Aerospace has led the world in the design, engineering, and manufacture of assemblies and components for aerospace markets, advanced products for military and space markets, and complementary specialty products. We continue to develop new rocket motor systems for...
magellan.aero magellan.aero
www.gd-otscanada.com

General Dynamics Ordnance and Tactical Systems - Canada

A world-class developer and manufacturer of all-caliber ammunition and energetic materials intended for the military and armed police forces.
www.gd-otscanada.com www.gd-otscanada.com

And we have lots of electronics and software companies.
 
Furniture said:
Or, it's the logical answer based on the reality of the war. The war in Ukraine is unpopular in Russia, doing something that gives the Russians a reason to rally behind the flag is not in Ukraine's best interests.

Russians aren't dumber than we are, they know the difference between NATO forces engaging Russian forces, and NATO equipment being used by Ukraine against Russian forces. The minute Putin and his supporters can show real CNN or BBC reports of NATO forces directly engaging in the fight, it will justify all of their "NATO is coming after us" silliness.

While that's not guaranteed to rally all of Russia behind the war, it's quite likely to reverse a lot of the negative opinion of the war.
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but where does appeasement end? Hungary 1956, the Chechs 1968, Poland in the 70's, Georgia, and on and on. If we had once said this far and no further and demonstrated our determination by standing firm we Ukraine and Russia both might not be mauling each other now. ???
 
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