Author Topic: AEC Aircrew Selection  (Read 29411 times)

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Offline LOLslamball

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AEC Aircrew Selection
« on: January 02, 2012, 18:42:08 »
I am currently applying for AEC through the ROTP program and am scheduled to go to Trenton to undergo aircrew selection. I haven't been told much about the actual simulator or testing and was hoping someone had some more information. I was told this is the first year the simulator/test has been administered.

The study guide given to me was for CAPSS and was written in 2007.

Thanks in advance.

edit: I got the impression that I was not told details about the testing because my MCC didn't know much about it, not because I am not allowed to know.

aesop081

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Re: AEC Aircrew Selection
« Reply #1 on: January 02, 2012, 18:43:10 »
You must have applies for ACSO or pilot as well.......AEC do not go through aircrew selection in trenton. Or theres been a sudden change.

Offline LOLslamball

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Re: AEC Aircrew Selection
« Reply #2 on: January 02, 2012, 18:48:55 »
I applied for pilot, and was found suitable but not competitive, so I thought about it and went back and changed my application to AEC.

AEC is the only trade listed on my application, and the first sessions of this testing was run in December.  I think two sessions have been completed.

The join instrustions on the link below state that they are for Pilot/AEC and this table is pasted from the join instructions

AEC Selection
Wed.                                                       Thurs.                 Thurs. eve., or Fri.
arrival at                                                Aircrew Tests
CFASC 32 Buffalo Ave, Trenton                                               departure
Yukon Lodge Trenton                                                       for home


http://www.rcaf-arc.forces.gc.ca/8w-8e/units-unites/page-eng.asp?id=1210#

aesop081

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Re: AEC Aircrew Selection
« Reply #3 on: January 02, 2012, 18:55:32 »
Fair enough, things change.

Don't worry about the CAPSS machine, not much you can do to prepare for it other than a bit of flight sim time on your computer. The thing shows you what you need to do, just be familiar with what is in the CAPSS book. The written tests are math intensive as well as spatial ability. Knowing a little about what basic aircraft instruments tell you will help. The rest is speed reading tables and you cant really prepare for that. They likely have added ( or something only for AECs) so this may all have changed a bit since i went there in 2008.

Offline Ditch

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Re: AEC Aircrew Selection
« Reply #4 on: January 02, 2012, 18:58:50 »
Looks like you will just be subjected to the written tests.  Not much point putting you in the CAPSS box since you won't be near any flight controls as an AEC.

It appears that they have instituted some sort of selection criteria for the AEC trade - hence the testing done on Thursday morning.  In the blue book, just focus on the written test portion - ignore anything that refers to the "simulator".
Per Ardua Ad Astra

Offline LOLslamball

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Re: AEC Aircrew Selection
« Reply #5 on: January 02, 2012, 19:12:56 »
Thanks for the replies,

I am not sure as to the format of the test, I think it is on computers or a new simulator, but it may include written parts too. 

When I was looking up CAPSS there was a DND publication that explained a lot about it and a lot of things that I would not disclose after I had finished, but I haven't found a scrap of anything online about this testing yet.

aesop081

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Re: AEC Aircrew Selection
« Reply #6 on: January 02, 2012, 19:17:37 »
Thanks for the replies,

I am not sure as to the format of the test, I think it is on computers or a new simulator, but it may include written parts too. 

When I was looking up CAPSS there was a DND publication that explained a lot about it and a lot of things that I would not disclose after I had finished, but I haven't found a scrap of anything online about this testing yet.

The CAPSS ( the "simulator") is for pilot candidates only. Don't worry about it. If they have something new for AEC candidates, this is what you will have to worry about. I am sure they will show you what you need to do when you are there.

Offline LOLslamball

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Re: AEC Aircrew Selection
« Reply #7 on: January 02, 2012, 19:21:45 »
I suppose all candidates are on level footing.  I was just hoping to study more efficiently before I arrived.

Offline biggs

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Re: AEC Aircrew Selection
« Reply #8 on: January 02, 2012, 19:43:38 »
Interesting.  I had heard through the grapevine that they were looking at implementing a pre-enrollment selection test for AEC applicants, but I didn't think they'd started using it already.  From what I was told, it's aimed at reducing the number of candidates who fail in phase training, which is fairly high.

I would imagine it's a written or computer based test, similar in format (but not necessarily subject matter) to the ACSO test.  Like any sort of selection or screening process, just give it your level best and hope it turns out.

Offline Melbatoast

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Re: AEC Aircrew Selection
« Reply #9 on: January 03, 2012, 01:23:28 »
Here's some more speculation, but maybe the AEC stuff is based on the "experimental" CBT they were giving pilot candidates for a while.  I did it in 2009, I don't know if they are still doing it (it didn't count toward your selection, they were just going to compare your performance versus how you do/did in training after passing CAPSS).  It was more typical of airline-industry abstract style psychomotor testing, rather than CAPSS which provides a more directly observable (to the casual onlooker) connection to flying.  It might, might also work for AEC selection.

This is a guess.  Don't make any plans based on this wild-*** guess.

Offline LOLslamball

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Re: AEC Aircrew Selection
« Reply #10 on: January 03, 2012, 01:40:38 »
It would make sense seeing as CAPSS was developed over 10 years and they obviously have to test the tests to make sure they work.

I won't base anything on your guess, but I will take a look into it and I'll let you know when I get back.

Offline biggs

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Re: AEC Aircrew Selection
« Reply #11 on: January 03, 2012, 10:51:27 »
Well, I was holding back from speculating that far, but there may be something to what Melbatoast said.

When I was on SLT, they had all the AEC 2LTs in the language school go over to Cornwall for a day and do that very test.  I had done the same one when I was at CFASC (also in 2009).  Apparently they left out the stick-and-rudder stuff, but they did everything else.  Also, if I recall correctly, this is a test the RAF uses for their aircrew selection.

It was pretty clear that this was a trial to establish a baseline.  All the AECs at the language school at that time had not gone through any pre-enrollment selection, nor had they started their phase training.  They will no doubt have their career progress compared to their results on this test to see how good it is at predicting training success.  However I'm surprised they've forged ahead and are already using it for pre-enrollment selection.

P.S. You weren't by any chance at CFASC in June of 2009, were you Melbatoast?

(Edit: Missing word in a sentence...)
« Last Edit: January 03, 2012, 10:56:52 by biggs »

Offline Melbatoast

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Re: AEC Aircrew Selection
« Reply #12 on: January 03, 2012, 20:18:10 »

P.S. You weren't by any chance at CFASC in June of 2009, were you Melbatoast?


Nope, April. 

Good intel on the other stuff. 

For the candidates there is a lot of free stuff of that style available on the web, and you can buy practice material, too, if you are really convinced it will help you and have the money.

Offline LOLslamball

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Re: AEC Aircrew Selection
« Reply #13 on: January 03, 2012, 23:41:50 »

For the candidates there is a lot of free stuff of that style available on the web, and you can buy practice material, too, if you are really convinced it will help you and have the money.

I am neither, but I've already found lots to study.

Did you mean psychomotor testing or psychometric testing?

From what I have gathered from google I think that psychomotor is responding to questions using motor skills. And it usually tests spatial ability and/or motor skills.

While Psychometric testing is timed aptitude tests such as the CFAT.  Which is what NAV Canada uses in their application process.


Offline biggs

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Re: AEC Aircrew Selection
« Reply #14 on: January 04, 2012, 14:04:06 »
If you read my previous post carefully you'll realize it will most likely be the latter.

While the trial test that Toast and I did at CFASC as pilot candidates included both a psychomotor (stick and rudder) and a psychometric portion, the trial test they had the untrained AECs do was only the psychometric part.

Logically, it would follow that this will be the case for you as an AEC candidate. The fact that Nav Canada uses those types of tests further supports that idea, as they train both civillian and military air traffic controllers.

Offline SentryMAn

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Re: AEC Aircrew Selection
« Reply #15 on: January 04, 2012, 15:24:34 »
so....after reading this and pondering awhile, then looking on the forces website I came to the conclusion that I do not know what AEC stands for?  I see ACSO, AEO and ACO but no AEC listed?

 

aesop081

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Re: AEC Aircrew Selection
« Reply #16 on: January 04, 2012, 15:27:28 »

Offline SentryMAn

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Re: AEC Aircrew Selection
« Reply #17 on: January 04, 2012, 15:39:34 »
I just thought that would be ACO, ;-)

Offline LOLslamball

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Re: AEC Aircrew Selection
« Reply #18 on: January 26, 2012, 15:29:57 »
Melbatoast and Biggs, I'd just like to thank you for your information and responses.

It ended up being the first session ever, and 3 of 7 passed.  Thankfully I was one of them. 

The testing was probably similar to what you beta tested, from speaking with an MCC after wards it sounded like  they had been testing it for awhile.  Not an AEC simulator, just a lot of aptitude stuff. 

It was something that would be extremely hard to study for, unless you were told exactly what was on the test.  Luckily for me a lot of the stuff was right up my alley, thanks to my mom forcing me to practice it during elementary school.

Offline biggs

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Re: AEC Aircrew Selection
« Reply #19 on: January 30, 2012, 21:14:58 »
Glad to hear you passed.  If your mom was drilled you on that stuff when you were in grade school, I'll bet you weren't thanking her for it at the time.  :D

They surely had been beta testing it for a while since we did it 2 1/2 years ago, and we probably weren't the first.  The point of using it for AEC candidates is so they don't have so many people failing in phase training, which I've heard was upwards of 50% for that trade before they had the selection.  It'll be interesting to see if having the test cuts down on that. 

Offline LOLslamball

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Re: AEC Aircrew Selection
« Reply #20 on: February 14, 2012, 16:03:30 »
Glad to hear you passed.  If your mom was drilled you on that stuff when you were in grade school, I'll bet you weren't thanking her for it at the time.  :D

They surely had been beta testing it for a while since we did it 2 1/2 years ago, and we probably weren't the first.  The point of using it for AEC candidates is so they don't have so many people failing in phase training, which I've heard was upwards of 50% for that trade before they had the selection.  It'll be interesting to see if having the test cuts down on that.

You bet, looking back on it I think I only hated it like half the time....but in the moment I probably didn't enjoy much of it at all.

I also heard something about them tweaking the training.  I know for a fact that VFR, IFR and Weapons are separated much sooner than they used to be.  I heard (which may or may not be true) that they have tried to break it more into sections, so instead of flunking the whole course, students can just re-do the part they failed.

Either way it still will be extremely hard and it is a long way down the road for me. (hopefully)

Offline snyper21

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Re: AEC Aircrew Selection
« Reply #21 on: April 11, 2012, 00:07:20 »
I am interested to know considering the changes made to the AEC selection process at Trenton if this induces any effect/change on the pilot testing portion done at ASC. Does anyone know if the simulator portion is still the only test that evaluates your suitability for the pilot trade, or is there computer based testing that counts towards your total score, and determines in part whether you pass ASC?

Offline BullseyeTex

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Re: AEC Aircrew Selection
« Reply #22 on: April 19, 2012, 18:05:29 »
Hi all.

First off what a great recource these forums are.  I have really enjoyed reading them and appreciate all you members that take the time to share your knowledge with us.  Thank you.

I have gone through my interview/medical etc. for pilot and have made it to point where I am now waiting to hear when I will be scheduled for ASC.  I found an older post regarding the simulators and the instrument layout, but was curious if it is still the same.  The post mentioned that the panel was a C-172 panel.  Is that still the case?  Haven't been able to find anything else on it as yet.

I've got the gist of ASC, crosscheck, relax, follow instructions, and that prior flying experience doesn't necessarily help at all.  Would be good to know what the panel layout is though out of curiosity.  It's been a very long road for me to get here.  Applied when I was 18 years old for pilot, only to find out I got sunk by a minor vision issue.  Pretty crushing considering it was all I had ever wanted to do.  Went on to become a biologist.  That was 22 years ago and now I've come full circle.  Yup, I'm 40 (just turned) and am still rarin to go!  Not going to put all my eggs in this basket, but I'm ecstatic to have finally progressed to ASC and if that's where it ends then so be it, but I want to make sure I do as much research and get as much info as I can.

Funny, I have a bunch of Navy folks to thank for this.  I got to talking to them here in Victoria and they informed me about the changes in the eye sight standards and that age wasn't really a factor, and here I am.   ;D

At any rate, thanks to those that post on here and thanks for any information you provide.  Maybe I'll see some of you around sometime.

Offline LOLslamball

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Re: AEC Aircrew Selection
« Reply #23 on: April 19, 2012, 20:24:13 »
Glad to hear you're finally getting to Aircrew Selection.....but you've posted in the wrong thread. This one is for AEC Aircrew Selection, not Pilot Aircrew Selection.

Good Luck

Offline AEC

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Re: AEC Aircrew Selection
« Reply #24 on: April 27, 2012, 13:52:58 »
Hi all I just wanted to let everyone know that I got my my offer for ROTP as an AEC! Thanks for all the answers I got through this forum!