Author Topic: Dealing with being home from Kandahar  (Read 183499 times)

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Offline Big Foot

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Re: Dealing with being home from Kandahar
« Reply #200 on: September 21, 2007, 12:29:14 »
All I can say is, excellent post, Piper.  :salute:
It's not insubordinate if you know exactly where the line is and walk on it but never cross it.

Offline Greymatters

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Re: Dealing with being home from Kandahar
« Reply #201 on: September 21, 2007, 13:07:24 »
I tend to think that warriors reserve the term hero -- I believe that RHFC would agree with me.

I would disagree on the restrictive definition you have here.  Putting aside the 'official definitions' when people speak of heroes they speak of people who:

- are acting above and beyond the call of duty during strenuous, dangerous or chaotic times.
- are significantly risking their indivudual life and welfare.
- perform acts above and beyond what is considered socially normal. 
- are doing something that is not their responsiblity to do.
- demonstrate characteristics that are seen as the finest in human qualities.
- are taking action while others do nothing.
- are risking their lives while performing an act not required of them.
- are acting to assist another person.
- perform a 'personal sacrifice'.

This can most commonly be referred to soldiers ('warriors') only because soldiers face the risk of death far more often than your average person, and encounter such situations freqently, and rightfully so.  But there are other persons who are not warriors (possibly warriors in spirit) that still earn this title as well.

- a man runs into a burning building and saves someone elses child.
- a doctor stays behind to treat the victims of a virulent plague despite the risk of contraction and the unlikelihood that the victims have any hope of survival.
- a nurse drives herself to the point of exhaustion while taking care of hundreds of soldiers by herself.
- a person jumps into a raging flood to save someone else who is drowning. 

Would you agree?


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Re: Dealing with being home from Kandahar
« Reply #202 on: September 21, 2007, 13:11:02 »
The key word is "distinguished" courage.  Not all who are courageous are heroes. 

Also, people talk of "heroic" actions on football fields, hockey rinks, and the like.  Let's not overuse the word, lest it lose its meaning.
So, there I was....

Offline Greymatters

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Re: Dealing with being home from Kandahar
« Reply #203 on: September 21, 2007, 13:31:57 »
The key word is "distinguished" courage.  Not all who are courageous are heroes.  Also, people talk of "heroic" actions on football fields, hockey rinks, and the like.  Let's not overuse the word, lest it lose its meaning.

True!  The only heroic action Ive ever heard of on the ice rink was when a player got his carotid artery sliced by a skate and would have bled to death within minutes if the Zamboni driver had not grabbed two pairs of plyers and clamped off the artery (true story!).   

Assessment = 5.5 OUT OF 9:
- are acting above and beyond the call of duty during strenuous, dangerous or chaotic times. - MAYBE
- are significantly risking their indivudual life and welfare. - NO
- perform acts above and beyond what is considered socially normal. - YES
- are doing something that is not their responsiblity to do. - YES
- demonstrate characteristics that are seen as the finest in human qualities. - YES
- are taking action while others do nothing. - YES
- are risking their lives while performing an act not required of them. - NO
- are acting to assist another person. - YES
- perform a 'personal sacrifice'. - NO, OTHER THAN MIGHT GET SUED
- BONUS QUALITY: peformed an act usually repugnant to others, or feared by others, due to blood, possible contraction of communicable diseases, fear of being close to death or other persons close to death, and unwillingness to deal with a crisis.

He wouldnt be a national hero, but that local group of people would regard him as a hero. 

Offline ArmyVern

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Re: Dealing with being home from Kandahar
« Reply #204 on: September 21, 2007, 13:39:46 »

This can most commonly be referred to soldiers ('warriors') only because soldiers face the risk of death far more often than your average person, and encounter such situations freqently, and rightfully so.  But there are other persons who are not warriors (possibly warriors in spirit) that still earn this title as well.

- a man runs into a burning building and saves someone elses child.
- a doctor stays behind to treat the victims of a virulent plague despite the risk of contraction and the unlikelihood that the victims have any hope of survival.
- a nurse drives herself to the point of exhaustion while taking care of hundreds of soldiers by herself.
- a person jumps into a raging flood to save someone else who is drowning. 

Would you agree?

I think you've read way too much into Kevin's post. He is speaking from the military standpoint. Soldiers -- read "warriors" -- (well most) do not consider themselves heroes ... they are just doing their jobs. If one's a "hero", they all are.

I'd argue that a fire-fighter, police officer etc would all say the same thing.

Wouldn't you agree?

Now some of those "heros" will go on (or already have) to perform courageous acts in their lives and professions, others will never have to.
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Offline s_macP

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Re: Dealing with being home from Kandahar
« Reply #205 on: September 21, 2007, 13:52:43 »
Whoa sorry guys and gals, I didnt mean to start a big debate over the meaning of hero here. In fact, I could have said what I was triyng to say better with much fewer words. Here it goes to all of you, thanks.

Offline the 48th regulator

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Re: Dealing with being home from Kandahar
« Reply #206 on: September 21, 2007, 13:55:47 »
Hey,

You can call me a Hero if you want.  Not becasue of the injuries I received, but for having to read some of the wierdest posts at the wee hours of the Morning that I have had to bin....

dileas

tess
I know that I’m not perfect and that I don’t claim to be, so before you point your fingers make sure your hands are clean.

Offline --NES--

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Re: Dealing with being home from Kandahar
« Reply #207 on: September 21, 2007, 14:14:54 »
Hey,

You can call me a Hero if you want.  Not becasue of the injuries I received, but for having to read some of the wierdest posts at the wee hours of the Morning that I have had to bin....

dileas

tess




You're my hero, pisan.  ;D
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Offline KevinB

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Re: Dealing with being home from Kandahar
« Reply #208 on: September 21, 2007, 14:27:53 »
Piper - I will however buy you a beer when I get back to Canada  :salute:
  Excellent post.

I was not trying to make a huge issue out of this beleive it or not.
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Offline --NES--

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Re: Dealing with being home from Kandahar
« Reply #209 on: September 21, 2007, 14:31:23 »
Piper - I will however buy you a beer when I get back to Canada  :salute:
  Excellent post.

Thanks...  I wouldn't mind hearing some war stories from the other sand box... maybe trade up some SOPs and lessons learned over a few pints of Stella.

I was not trying to make a huge issue out of this beleive it or not.

Heh... yeah...  I knew where you were coming from, and I've seen it going on for a while, the time was right to 'address' the issue.

It's all good.
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Offline Greymatters

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Re: Dealing with being home from Kandahar
« Reply #210 on: September 21, 2007, 15:24:08 »
hmm it seemed to eat my reply...

  I tend to think that warriors reserve the term hero -- I beleive that RHFC would agree with me.

I think its pretty self-evident what he wrote, which implies that the term of hero is reserved for warriors.  If that is not what he meant then by all means I have read too much into it.  Although only he can tell us that. 

Offline Greymatters

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Re: Dealing with being home from Kandahar
« Reply #211 on: September 21, 2007, 15:29:42 »
He is speaking from the military standpoint. Soldiers -- read "warriors" -- (well most) do not consider themselves heroes ... they are just doing their jobs. If one's a "hero", they all are.  I'd argue that a fire-fighter, police officer etc would all say the same thing.  Wouldn't you agree?  Now some of those "heros" will go on (or already have) to perform courageous acts in their lives and professions, others will never have to. 

Yes I would agree will that completely. 

Offline --NES--

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Re: Dealing with being home from Kandahar
« Reply #212 on: September 21, 2007, 15:34:58 »
I think its pretty self-evident what he wrote, which implies that the term of hero is reserved for warriors.  If that is not what he meant then by all means I have read too much into it.  Although only he can tell us that. 

I think, unless I'm way way off base, that what he meant by "reserve" was:  Noun "Something kept back or saved for future use or a special purpose" or Adjective "Kept in reserve especially for emergency use"  in the sense that "warriors" have reservations about using the term "heroic" to describe the manner in which they do their job on a regular basis.

In simpler terms;
Soldiers -- read "warriors" -- (well most) do not consider themselves heroes ... they are just doing their jobs. If one's a "hero", they all are.


But, like I said... could be off... but that's how I read it.
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Offline Greymatters

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Re: Dealing with being home from Kandahar
« Reply #213 on: September 21, 2007, 15:38:47 »
I think, unless I'm way way off base, that what he meant by "reserve" was:  Noun "Something kept back or saved for future use or a special purpose" or Adjective "Kept in reserve especially for emergency use"  in the sense that "warriors" have reservations about using the term "heroic" to describe the manner in which they do their job on a regular basis.

If thats the case, then I did indeed read too much into it.   

Offline the 48th regulator

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Re: Dealing with being home from Kandahar
« Reply #214 on: September 21, 2007, 15:40:12 »
He was calling you reserve, as in rental/toon/SAS. 

That's it dukes up, fight in the mess, yehaw!

dileas

tess

I know that I’m not perfect and that I don’t claim to be, so before you point your fingers make sure your hands are clean.

Offline Greymatters

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Re: Dealing with being home from Kandahar
« Reply #215 on: September 21, 2007, 15:46:35 »
He was calling you reserve, as in rental/toon/SAS.  That's it dukes up, fight in the mess, yehaw! 

I have no idea what you're talking about here...

Offline BulletMagnet

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Re: Dealing with being home from Kandahar
« Reply #216 on: September 21, 2007, 15:48:08 »
That's ok neither does he  ;)
« Last Edit: September 22, 2007, 08:23:42 by HitorMiss »
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Offline the 48th regulator

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Re: Dealing with being home from Kandahar
« Reply #217 on: September 21, 2007, 15:48:28 »
Comedic play on words RP is a reservist/militia.

Names Reservists get called;

Rental, toons etc etc...

Aw I will crawl back into the Mod attic.

dileas

tess
I know that I’m not perfect and that I don’t claim to be, so before you point your fingers make sure your hands are clean.

Offline Greymatters

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Re: Dealing with being home from Kandahar
« Reply #218 on: September 21, 2007, 15:58:03 »
Comedic play on words RP is a reservist/militia.  Names Reservists get called; Rental, toons etc etc...  Aw I will crawl back into the Mod attic. 

Im getting an image of you as the hunchback of Notre Dame.

So, you mean 'weekend warriors'?  Dont recall hearing the other names before, possibly centric to Ontario?  Although these terms might apply to reservists I have met in the past, you're not one that I would apply them to. 

Offline --NES--

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Re: Dealing with being home from Kandahar
« Reply #219 on: September 21, 2007, 15:58:28 »
He was calling you reserve, as in rental/toon/SAS. 

That's it dukes up, fight in the mess, yehaw!

dileas

tess



 :rofl:

Rental... fantastic. 

So... you're saying only toons can be heros?  ;D


Btw.
For those who don't know;
SAS = Saturdays And Sundays
then there's SWAT
Some Weekends And Thursdays
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Re: Dealing with being home from Kandahar
« Reply #220 on: September 21, 2007, 18:42:43 »
So..... yup well, thought I was going to say something but really cannot compete with Piper's prose... all I can say is wow is it fun to see how conversation switches track.   Reserve, Regular who cares to put on a uniform and knowingly go out into danger to me is a hero.  Same goes for the police, firefighters etc.  Anyway, enough on that track!
 ;D

Offline fireman451

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Re: Dealing with being home from Kandahar
« Reply #221 on: February 18, 2008, 21:42:55 »
Piper I was in the platoon that did the handover to you guys in Afghanistan, your story hits home for me in many ways. I remember hearing about that incident and feeling very relieved to have made it out unscathed , then followed by an intense feeling of guilt. I had a major case of surviver guilt which I carry still. The men we lost weighs on me now , "why them and not me" rattles me still, in time I think I'll come to terms.

I left the battalion and wouldn't wish my experience on anyone, although it changed me irrevocably, in some ways for the better. Although I am much happier out of the Infantry , not a day goes by I don't think of the men and women (Capt Goddard) we lost during that tour. To all who continue to serve or wish to deploy , good luck and be careful what you wish for.     
.     

Offline --NES--

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Re: Dealing with being home from Kandahar
« Reply #222 on: September 04, 2008, 16:34:15 »

I didn't really want to revive this old thread and pour more crap on the heap, but I've been thinking about this all week and I just wanted to get it all down... and after reading BulletMagnets write up yesterday, I couldn't think of much else.

Two years and one day ago, the soldiers of Charles Company, 1 RCR began the ground offensive in Panjwayi for Op Medusa...  We will take this as read, since we all know the details.  That day, we, as a Forces, lost four brothers.

Two years ago today, the same soldiers who fought into Pashmul were hit again by friendly fire...  and we lost another brother in arms.   
As well, 38 of us were wounded and 6 (including myself) were sent to Germany.  Again, we all know the story...

Since then, I haven't had a single day were I didn't think, even for a brief moment, about those Brothers in arms lost to the mission.  There hasn't even been a day when I haven't thought about all my brothers who were wounded, or even just about the soldiers I worked with, who are all scattered across the forces, both regular and reserve.
And when we lose another 3 on the anniversary, I can't help but think of the soldiers over there, and the next group to take their place.

It has been two years... So much has changed in my life because of what happened over there;
The Military has seen fit to send me to college while still on Class C (class B in Feb/Mar) and I have been employed by the forces since I got home, which allowed me to buy my first house and get married..  But with the good comes the bad;  I still can't run, I still have pain and physical problems from the shrapnel I still carry in my Kidneys. I'm still on limited duties and my military career has pretty much stalled out...  But, I'm alive.

Some days, the good out weighs the bad.  Especially when I think about my future with the education opportunity the military has provided... but, that is always overshadowed by the loss and injury of friends it took to get these opportunities.
I have no idea what my fate would have been if I came home from tour without injury; I probably would have just gone back to the job I did before tour (machining), which I can't do now.  Perhaps I would have taken the fast CT to 3 RCR and be off on another tour.   Who knows, I probably would have even taken PLQ and have a leaf by now...  But, that's not the case.  I am where I am because I was in the wrong place at the wrong time.

Anyway, I'm not going to turn this into a long, boring diatribe... I'm too tired and sore...  All I wanted to get across was; I miss the boys... I miss the life.... I miss being over there.  I hope everyone there comes home safe, and for those who came home less than safe, I hope you get the help and support you need.  And for the Friends and Family of the fallen; I will never forget them, or what they did.  Take care of yourselves and rely on your military family.

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Offline WB

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Re: Dealing with being home from Kandahar
« Reply #223 on: September 04, 2008, 17:26:15 »
Have a beer and take a moment... ;)

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Offline geo

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Re: Dealing with being home from Kandahar
« Reply #224 on: September 04, 2008, 20:38:58 »
Piper...

God bless & take care of yourself (+ with 9D)

CHIMO!
Chimo!