Topic: Canadian Sniper holds World Record - Macleans Article

[big bad john (John Hill)]

This article is a must read.

http://www.macleans.ca/topstories/canada/article.jsp?content=20060515_126689_126689

May 15, 2005

'We were abandoned'

An elite unit of snipers went from standouts to outcasts -- victims, many say, of a witch hunt driven by jealousy and fear

MICHAEL FRISCOLANTI

[MdB [3]]

I read the article in MacLean's paper version. It is very interesting and very thorough. At least, he seems to set the record straight by telling the story from the bullet and before until now.

The only thing is that he may not get access to the whole story. What are/were the motivations behind the CofC and NIS actions. We only get a glimpse from an NIS spokesperson, which is 'we did our job'. Now, we have to wait for the CF Ombudsman report on the investigation. He may tells us the rest of the story.

The other thing that struck me, being an officer candidate and CF member prospect, is that the soldier(s) think they are disposable. Really, to build confidence in the institution and to instill leadership and sense of belonging, it shatters pretty much any illusion you might have in case things go wrong like that. The guy was a hard-head... Don't think it's enough to justify what happened. I don't think too that, if Ombudsman's report blame the CofC/NIS, there will be any apologize.

[MediPea]

I read that article a few days ago and found it to be a very good read. It was really insightful to read where each guy has ended up since, and what they thought of the situation and how it was handled.

[Bobbyoreo]

I found this was a very good article. Gave me more details.

[Michael Dorosh]

The only thing is that he may not get access to the whole story. What are/were the motivations behind the CofC and NIS actions. We only get a glimpse from an NIS spokesperson, which is 'we did our job'. Now, we have to wait for the CF Ombudsman report on the investigation. He may tells us the rest of the story.

Unfortunately, stories about staff officers and the enforcers of discipline don't sell very well, so that may be forlorn hope, at least as far as reading about it in Maclean's goes.

[Lone Wolf AT]

Not to be insensitive here but how many people come back from a tour and pull pin with no news fanfare?
They seem to all agree they weren't in it for the records.  I am surprised they published last names, esp of those still serving.  They did their job and did it well.  To me its a non issue.

How about the guy who killed a civie in A Stan who ran a police check point and is now not (to all accounts) allowed outside the wire to patrol and is being grilled by the keystone cops?

[Centurian1985]

(extensive rant deleted)

I find it shameful that they were treated that way.   

[little jim]

This board is an interesting and enlightening exchange of opinions and ideas.

Very recently there have been several posts (numerous) that have called into question statements made in various media pieces (LAV protection, Darfur)

That same mindset should be applied to this article.

It tells one side of a very sensitive issue from a very specific viewpoint.

[MdB [3]]

Not to be insensitive here but how many people come back from a tour and pull pin with no news fanfare?

Dropping is not the main point of the article. It is not recognizing their dedication by awarding them the Bronze Star and shaming them for good job done. And yet, Americans thanked them a lot. Must be the best recognition.

Unfortunately, stories about staff officers and the enforcers of discipline don't sell very well, so that may be forlorn hope, at least as far as reading about it in Maclean's goes.

Yeah, I agree 100%. It's Ombudsman's.

I thought Army.ca members would enlighten me as they did so many times. But, I know this is dirty laundry probably best to do indoors.

[medicineman]

It's kind of strange how this op was touted as the first combat operation since Korea, but when the boys started racking up dead opponents, it was a little on the taboo side to talk about it.  Even if you read "Not a Good Day to Die" by Sean Naylor, there is very little mention of what these guys did - very strange given how significant a contribution to the Op they made.  Not to sound like a conspiracy theorist, but echoes of the Medak episode in '93 are kind of ringing here - that was one of the worst kept secrets in the Canadian Army, just nobody outside believed it until the government finally came out and said "Oops, forgot to mention something awhile back...".  I'm also wondering if Naylor may have been asked to keep casualties inflicted by Canadian snipers out of the book for the same PR reasons.

Or maybe I'm making a mountain out of a molehill - just I'm a firm believer in "give credit where credit is due".

MM

[paracowboy]

to paraphrase myself (again) on another website, in another thread dealing with this:

I've already addressed this in a previous post, but in short, it's almost entirely false. The article is over-inflated hype. That is from the men who were there, many of whom are still in 3VP.

There were/are entirely unrelated issues at hand, that have caused a great deal of friction between the members who have left and the Army in general, as well as other individual soldiers. You don't need to know those reasons, and I won't air other people's dirty linen in public.

Which is not entirely the journalist's fault, as he's going off info from the former member's father, who is getting his info from the member in question. That being said, it would have behooved the journalist to talk with some of the soldiers who served alongside the man. Other facts would have come to light.

I think the final word goes to the men who served there and then. When a group of them were gathered around, reading it, they broke out in gales of laughter, then tossed it in the garbage.

[Lone Wolf AT]

"That being said, it would have behooved the journalist to talk with some of the soldiers who served alongside the man."

+1

[the 48th regulator [2]]

So what is being said here, is that the article is plain bunk?

hmm interesting.

dileas

tess

[Centurian1985]

I dont know about the accuracy of the story, but I can verify that the US guys in Bosnia were impressed by their work.  I was hearing about the record-making shots from US co-workers the same month that they were being made (so much for opsec).  Guys who the previous day would not have cared who I was wanted to come up and tell me what a great job the guys did on that operation.

[Enzo]

You can always feel the "shift" when what was once myth, becomes legend.